The following press release was sent out tonight by the occupiers in Jessop West, remember to send solidarity and feel free to visit us in the exhibition centre at any time:
23rd March 2009
Sheffield University Occupiers: Occupation Spreads to Jessop West!
The Occupiers in the University of Sheffield have occupied a new space within the University, namely the exhibition centre in Jessop West, a brand new, flagship building for the university. As the time of press, the original occupation in the Hicks building continues throughout the night. Our reasons for expanding the occupation are as follows:
- Threats from the University management to evict students and workers from the original space.
- A complete lockdown was instigated, denying free movement for Occupiers and supporters.
- To increase pressure on University management after they went back on a promise to negotiate with the Occupiers.
- Throughout the occupation, the management had accused the Occupiers of disrupting students’ education, and as a result, those involved have occupied a new space in which no lectures and seminars take place. This serves to demonstrate our continuing commitment to not disrupting students’ education.
Furthermore, we feel an important point about the new space we have occupied has to be made. Our demands include a call for the university to donate resources to Gazan educational institutions, and to fund scholarships for Palestinian students, who are some of the poorest in the world, and whose universities have been devastated by the recent Israeli onslaught. We feel fulfilling these demands would be a much better use of resources - which include students’ fees - than the £21 million development that is the new Jessop complex. As previously mentioned, the development contains little or no teaching space, and as such is of little use to University of Sheffield students and/or teaching staff.
This move marks over a week in occupation where our numbers have risen to as high as 100 people. Today, on the seventh day of the occupation, meetings attracted over 50 people in spite of the fact that the building was on full lockdown.
Whilst university management continue to exclude the Occupiers from negotiations, relationships with university staff remain friendly, and the occupation remains peaceful, strong and positive. Messages of support and solidarity continue to pour in from fellow occupiers around the country, fellow students, Members of Parliament, other activist groups from inside and outside the university, and university staff and lecturers. The occupation has hosted a range of events and will continue to do so - discussions, guest lectures, talks and film showings - which all supporters are welcome to attend.
The Palestine Society, the University of Sheffield Islamic Circle, the Black Students Committee and the Jewish Society have all been invited to take part in the proposed negotiations with the University management - all of whom oppose the University’s decision to exclude the Occupiers from the negotiation process. As the demands were not drawn up by any of these groups, and they have no means of putting pressure on the university other than via the occupation, we see little chance of progress being made on this issue until members of the occupation are invited to participate in these talks.
Our demands remain thus:
As student activists and members of the University of Sheffield community, we call on the university to:
1) Issue a statement condemning the disproportionate actions of the Israeli state against the Palestinian people.
2) Create a special programme of five Palestinian scholarships and waive all fees for current students from the occupied territories.
3) Enter into an academic partnership with the University of Gaza.
4) Donate old books, computers and other relevant equipment to the University of Gaza, and pay for the transport of these materials.
5) Publicise the Disaster Emergency Committee (DEC) appeal on Sheffield University notice boards, website and via email.
6) Initiate a programme in partnership with students of divestment and ending links with the arms trade.
7) Allow those studying medicine to carry out their electives in the occupied territories of Palestine.
8) Commemorate the United Nations Palestine Solidarity Day on November 29th.
9) Echo the Occupation's statement of support with Israeli students who have been imprisoned for refusing to serve in the IDF.
We have taken this action because we believe our university should be run democratically from below by students and staff, and not in the interests of corporate profiteering. Because of this belief, we express our solidarity with university workers and demand:
10)That they face no cuts in jobs, wages or conditions.
We further demand
11) That participants in, or supporters of, the occupation face no repercussions.
We will continue our occupation until our demands are met, or meaningful negotiations on our demands begin.
Yours -
The Sheffield Occupiers.
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Not willing to face the consequences of your actions - pathetic
ReplyDelete^^^^^^
ReplyDeleteNot willing to stand for innocent children being murdered - pathetic
"Initiate a programme in partnership with students of divestment and ending links with the arms trade."
ReplyDeletecan someone from the occupation please explain exactly what this means? Who constitutes the "arms trade"?
"we believe our university should be run democratically from below by students and staff, and not in the interests of corporate profiteering."
ReplyDeleteoh gosh, I knew all the "comrades" being thrown about would lead to something bad.
PALESTINE! remember! I think that's why it started.
The uni is doing great as a business, corporate profiteering aka capitalism aka the real world
"We have taken this action because we believe our university should be run democratically from below by students and staff... We will continue our occupation until our demands are met, or meaningful negotiations on our demands begin."
ReplyDeleteSo if i gather 50 shouting people in a room, that's democracy? No, arbitrarily deciding upon an enemy doesn't progress anything. What does the university as an organisation have to do with any of your 11 listed demands, other than the fact that you have deliberately decided to antagonise them?
Well done, keep up the good work.
ReplyDeleteMorons
ReplyDeletei've never known something so undemocratic in my entire life
ReplyDeleteNow you're just making an exhibition of yourselves
ReplyDelete:D
as a student involved in the original students against israel's attack on gaza campaign i can assure you that the palsoc and isoc and definitely some people from the black students committee were centrally involved in drawing up the demands. i don't have anything against occupiers being in the talks with the uni but please don't pretend the demands are the occupiers alone because they were clearly drawn up by another group and negotiations were begun long before the occupation started.
ReplyDeleteAh, negotiations
ReplyDeleteRemind me the difference between those and occupations again, it's all a bit confusing
Negotiations = what grown ups do
ReplyDeleteOccupations = what children do when they dont get their own way
"can someone from the occupation please explain exactly what this means? Who constitutes the "arms trade"?"
ReplyDeletehttp://justfuckinggoogleit.com/
Companies that manufacture and sell arms constitute the arms trade. I didn't think it was that hard to work out.
No, seriously, you may find http://www.caat.org.uk/campaigns/universities/data/yorks_and_humber.php to be of use.
So, dumping the investments we have in Cobham (£255,400), Rolls Royce (£135,177), Rolls Royce B (£3,006) and General Electric (£34,288) would be a nice start.
See http://www.studywarnomore.org.uk/data/sheffield.html for more information.
"i've never known something so undemocratic in my entire life" - Really? You must've led a marvellously sheltered life. Have you ever heard of Saudi Arabia? Have you ever had a job?
undemocratic - because the elected officers that we elected democratically voted against taking this action...but the minority of the elected officers went and did it anyway
ReplyDeletewhy yes i do have a job AND study - how do i fit it all in?!?!
"as a student involved in the original students against israel's attack on gaza campaign i can assure you that the palsoc and isoc and definitely some people from the black students committee were centrally involved in drawing up the demands. i don't have anything against occupiers being in the talks with the uni but please don't pretend the demands are the occupiers alone because they were clearly drawn up by another group and negotiations were begun long before the occupation started."
ReplyDelete- Heh. Sorry. This is what happens when you write statements at the end of a long hard day. What we were trying to get across was a) our demands are not exactly the same as those of the original group (as ours include support for Israeli war refusers and university workers, and we're worried about the possibility of these issues being dropped) and that without the occupiers being present, there's no way of putting pressure on the university to do anything (as we saw when the university unilaterally stopped negotiating, leading us to the start of this occupation).
"why yes i do have a job AND study - how do i fit it all in?!?!" Right. And how much say do you have in what goes on in your workplace? And I notice you dodged the question of whether or not you've heard of Saudi Arabia.
yeah - have you heard of Australia?
ReplyDeletedo you take me for a fool - of course i have - i'm just poking fun at the fact it annoys me how many of your arguements talk about democracy but this occupation was not made on a democratic decision
ReplyDeletedo not try and pull me into a web to try and justify yourselves
"this occupation was not made on a democratic decision"
ReplyDeleteWrong, we talked it over and had a vote, it was pretty democratic.
"do not try and pull me into a web to try and justify yourselves" - bad news mate, you're already in an interweb. :O
i heard you lost the vote
ReplyDeletevoting among yourselves isn't a democracy I'm afraid. if it was you could just elect yourself president of the UK.
ReplyDelete"10)That they face no cuts in jobs, wages or conditions."
ReplyDeleteIf you are such strong supporters of democracy and unionism as you claim to be, why not let university staff fight for themselves through their own unions? Or do you think you know better than them?
Furthermore, as has already been said by others you can't claim a democratic mandate simply because you held a vote within your own group. Show pride in your union and ballot its members, then see whether you get the democratic backing of real students.
Finally, if you want to attack University links with the arms trade, then that is a separate issue and lumping it in with other, more complex issues (like Israel/Palestine) that the University as an institution has no control over, is a suicidal error when there would have been full support for such a cause.
What are the arguments against the occupation. Everytime I come onto this blog I just find repetition and insults. No one is actually engaging in the ideas on any level. "Moron" isn't an argument.
ReplyDeleteI think it's worth noting that there is a real problem with the occupation detractors. The fact is that those opposing the occupation do so from common societal assumptions. There's not benefit trying to argue with someone about the relevance of confrontational tactics when they start from the notion that political protest is a waste of time. It's like trying to convince a dog that it exists. And frankly, why should we care? None of us are obligated to accommodate apathy and ignorance. If you don't care then don't.
It also should be noted that while other groups were obviously involved in the development of the demands, it was those that organised the occupation that ultimately instigated that process and without the occupation the negotiations would not exist.
"Finally, if you want to attack University links with the arms trade, then that is a separate issue"
ReplyDeleteNo it is not. Sheffield University has mass financial and educational links to several large arms manufacturers that then use those links to develop weaponary to be used on Palestinian people. This is not a seperate issue, in fact it is probably the most central of all issues.
So your issue with the arms trade is that weapons are used on Palestinian people, rather than on people all over the world?
ReplyDelete"This is not a seperate issue, in fact it is probably the most central of all issues."
ReplyDeleteWhich is precisely why it needs to be addressed on its own and not in the context of a single conflict.
Joe I do not think that occupiers will win any of their demands with the attitude you present. How can you ask everyone to open their communication channels when yours is apparently closed --->>>"Everytime I come onto this blog I just find repetition and insults. No one is actually engaging in the ideas on any level. "Moron" isn't an argument."<---
ReplyDeleteThere have been plenty polite critical posts, such as Tom's or the one from 09:51, but you prefer to notice only the rude ones.
As I said previously with people like you (idealist or socialist) it is either your way or no way.
This is the main reason why majority of socialist ruled states became hells on the earth. When a socialist gets what he was fighting all his life there is no way he will give it away peacefully...
Dear great students of Sheffield,
ReplyDeleteFrom the broken hearts of the people of Gaza, we salute you & what you represent as a great example of civil resistance to the magnanimous injustice that has been done to the Palestinian people, for 61 years, of slow genocide, and planned ethnic cleansing.
The "From the Students of Gaza" initiative has been created after the 22 day Israeli attack on the citizens of Gaza.
Students have witnessed, after a three year and ongoing siege, a man-slaughtering attack on them, their families, relatives, friends, and close ones. Many students are without financial aid to continue their education, and those who have dreams to pursue higher education throw those dreams in the bin & linger in a society crippled, where unemployment numbers rise by the week.
The attacks have destroyed many of these students' homes, their lives shaken... how can reading a book be acheived under such circumstances? Against the death of lives, dreams, ambitions, wills, homes... existence all and by itself devastated to nothingness...
We, hereby, join our voices with you & wish to make your demands responded to. As such, we hope you accept to add to your demands:
I. have a column at the university newspaper or magazine; if possible a "Gaza" section to allow for the writings of students here to be published weekly
II. organize discussion forums and lectures in collaboration with student clubs and societies, in addition to movements and other forms of organizations to allow for communication from Gaza. This could be arranged with the coordinators herein and with technical help would provide a audio, or even video, medium of communication
III. organize exhibitions/readings to allow for student in Gaza to express their writings/photos/videos, particularly of that concerned with the siege and latest massacre against the Palestinian citizens of Gaza
IV. if possible to arrange for financial aid or possible scholarships for the qualified students here, perhaps to attend the concerned university or for aid to continue education(which you already have on your list)
V. calling for academic institutions to divest from Apartheid Israel, and rainsing awareness about the Boycott, Divetments & Sanctions, also in demanding the boycott of Israeli goods on campus
We would also want to draw your attention to the fact that no "University of Gaza" exists in the Strip. The Islamic University had been extremely damaged by air strikes directed to the Women's dormitories and the universities scientific laboratories. Other prominent universities in Gaza include the Azhar University and the Aqsa University. We hope that you can help in reaching and be in contact with more than one university in Gaza, and perhaps create a connection with as many as possible, since all students have been affected one way or another.
We have sent you an email with some material such as letters from students here, and a documentary made especially for your call
We hope that we can establish a connection, for a better resistance against this Apartheid...
In Solidarity from Gaza, Palestine
Coordinator of "From the Students of Gaza" Initiative
(We have sent you an email to your account)
Can we safely assume the occupiers will move on to protesting in other businesses in their lives that support the arms trade once this occupation is over?
ReplyDeleteCan I expect to run into then in Tesco?
Surely this is setting a dangerous prescedent for action?
"We would also want to draw your attention to the fact that no "University of Gaza" exists in the Strip"
ReplyDeleteCompletely lost any support you had from me, you don't even know anything about the issues you are trying to raise
Yes there is a university in gaza, it's called the Islamic University of Gaza (http://www.iugaza.edu.ps/ar/), their president was in email contact with me throughout our occupation at Hallam and was very touched by our efforts, and said he'd been following all the England occupations online.
ReplyDeleteNatasha
ah! I didnt read any posts above the one above mine. I thought the person above was saying that there were no universities whatsoever, my mistake
ReplyDeleteWELL DONE SHEFFIELD!! you are a continued source of inspiration for us all!
ReplyDeleteKeep up the good work!
"http://justfuckinggoogleit.com/
ReplyDeleteCompanies that manufacture and sell arms constitute the arms trade. I didn't think it was that hard to work out.
No, seriously, you may find http://www.caat.org.uk/campaigns/universities/data/yorks_and_humber.php to be of use.
So, dumping the investments we have in Cobham (£255,400), Rolls Royce (£135,177), Rolls Royce B (£3,006) and General Electric (£34,288) would be a nice start.
See http://www.studywarnomore.org.uk/data/sheffield.html for more information."
What arms do Rolls-Royce manufacture? I was aware they made engines? That is why I asked what constitutes the arms trade, you think because they make engines for military air craft they are somehow contributing to oppression across the world or something.
Please state how Cobham, R&R, and GE contribute negatively to the palestinian conflict, and general conflicts around the world. Because I though R&R made OUR engines for OUR military. or is it just all a capitalist conspiracy?
Martin, but what you think about whether the demands will be met is really of no consequence and this is my point.
ReplyDeleteWithout the occupation Burnett would not be at the negotiating table. His emails try and make the claim that he is a reasonable chap trying to get the best for everyone, but the reality is that he's consistently been obstinate towards this process and the only reason he is deciding to negotiate is because a group of students and activists have maintained not one, but two occupations, one of which in his flagship £21 million farce of a building. We've got this far, there is no reason we can't go further and your opinion (as unfounded as it is) has no bearing on the actual process, of which you've not been apart of. And why is that? Probably because you don't actually care.
If the occupiers were really dedicated then being on lockdwon wouldn't be an issue becuase you wouldn't leave the building until your demands were met.
ReplyDeleteAn occupation when your coming and going when you feel like it.... it it isn't really an occupation is it?
hello, i am the person who posted the above "from the students of gaza"... we, in gaza, hope to establish a contact with you, if it helps us speaking in any way possible to help in establishing your demands, we are ready... we would really appreciate that our demands join yours as well.. also, as to there is no "university of gaza" in gaza... there has been a misunderstanding... there is "Islamic University" of Gaza... that can be edited... but, what is more important is the message...
ReplyDeletewe also hope that you contact other universities in the strip that also have prominence... for instance Aqsa University has the poorest of the poor in its varsity...
we really hope that you contact student activists here to work hand in hand...
in solidarity,
Natalie from Gaza
To Joe I am not saying that I do not care...
ReplyDeletebut only from a psychological point of view: How do you think VC is feeling right now???
(I am not saying that you should care about his feeling and please do not draw any other dumb conclusions from a simple question)
He is felling blackmailed. A person that feels blackmailed is not willing to discuss anything unless at the same time this person feels powerless.
Frankly speaking I do not see how 50 or even 100 students can intimidate whole University management... any ideas?
This is absoultely pathetic - you lost the democratic union vote and just went ahead with it anyway. This is an excellent display of Mugabe-esque democracy.
ReplyDelete"Frankly speaking I do not see how 50 or even 100 students can intimidate whole University management... any ideas?"
ReplyDeleteThe goal is not to intimidate the VC, it is to persuade management to enter into negotiations with the occupiers. At Universities such as Newcastle, Manchester, and many more (see www.occupations.org.uk for a comprehensive list of all the uni occupations for Gaza to date of which there is over 25) occupations have been the best and the most successful actions for getting demands met or at the very least for getting the student body and university management talking about Palestine. Occupation is a proven tactic - Students at many other universities have moved to occupy buildings on their campuses in the face of university management ignoring other actions such as petitioning for example, and have got results. The occupations have inspired other occupations. Most occupations have succeeded in at least securing some demands, or getting the Gaza issue raised.
Please stop asking futile questions like ' What is this occupation actually going to achieve?'
First - read our demands.
Second - look at what other occupations, with similar demands, have achieved. There's your answer. If other universities have sent aid to Gaza, developed scholarship programmes, had lively, educational open spaces during the occupations etc, who can blame us for trying?
Fuck sake. It's amazing that a group of about 0.5% of the Student body can think they're fighting for our cause when the other 99.5% honestly don't give a shit, or are just angry at the occupiers for being in existence.
ReplyDeleteI am not asking what is this occupation going to achieve...
ReplyDeleteI am just saying that you are not going to achieve what you want...
I bet you have some kind of minimal list of demands that you would be glad to push but in this case (not refereeing to other unis) I do not see it happening.
Have you drawn a cock on the roof?
ReplyDeleteThese people drew a cock on the roof
I think you should draw a cock on the roof
Go on
The union voted against the occupation so what? They do not nor can they ever hope to represent the entire body of students and can never possibly cover the depth, diversity and uniqueness of every single person on campus so why should they be the only ones that speak? I don't know what kind of a world it is some people want where the only people with a 'valid' opinion are beauraucrats who are paid to care.
ReplyDelete"What are the arguments against the occupation. Everytime I come onto this blog I just find repetition and insults. No one is actually (trying to) engage in the ideas on any level. "Moron" isn't an argument.
I think it's worth noting that there is a real problem with the occupation detractors. The fact is that those opposing the occupation do so from common societal assumptions. There's not benefit trying to argue with someone about the relevance of confrontational tactics when they start from the notion that political protest is a waste of time. It's like trying to convince a dog that it exists. And frankly, why should we care? None of us are obligated to accommodate apathy and ignorance. If you don't care then don't.
It also should be noted that while other groups were obviously involved in the development of the demands, it was those that organised the occupation that ultimately instigated that process and without the occupation the negotiations would not exist."
Shut up and get that cock drawn pronto
ReplyDeletewe want cock, we want cock, we want cock, we want cock, we want cock, we want cock, we want cock, we want cock, we want cock, we want cock, we want cock, we want cock, we want cock, we want cock.
ReplyDeleteGIVE US COCK
What a bunch of time-wasting backsliding work dodgers.
ReplyDelete"Press Release: Occupation Spreads to Jessop West!!!"
ReplyDeleteLike a tumour in a bloodstream...
Cock Cock Cock
ReplyDeleteEverybody loves the cock
Give us Cock
NOW
"The union voted against the occupation so what? They do not nor can they ever hope to represent the entire body of students and can never possibly cover the depth, diversity and uniqueness of every single person on campus so why should they be the only ones that speak?"
ReplyDeleteThe union reps are democratically elected by the entire student body, they therefore have infinitely more legitimacy than you. If you where serious about representing peoples views you would have campaigned and got elected. Instead you reject the process because you were too lazy and/or inept to campaign and win. What alternative do you propose as being representative....should we be ruled by bolshy hippies, first one to occupy a building wins?
"The union voted against the occupation so what? They do not nor can they ever hope to represent the entire body of students and can never possibly cover the depth, diversity and uniqueness of every single person on campus so why should they be the only ones that speak?"
ReplyDeleteBecause they represent the majority you knobber, its called democracy, if you think they're wrong persuade them otherwise. Just because you believe you're right doesn't mean you have any more right to enforce your agenda on others. You seem keen to express the sentiment that everyone's view should be equal but some are more equal than others it seems.
Personally I think the Israelis need to be reigned in but your "occupation" isn't going to help anyway.
Additionally have you any idea how spinless this is "11) That participants in, or supporters of, the occupation face no repercussions." I could have had at least a little respect for you in that you're willing to risk something for what you believe without that.
"first one to occupy a building wins?"
ReplyDeleteNo
First one to draw a cock on the roof wins
The situation in Gaza is a mess, and a travesty however neither side is the good side. Neither can be said to be right, both are murders. Whether a Palestinian child dies at the hands of Israel or an Israeli child at the hands of Hamas it does not matter one bit because both sides are in the wrong. And what are all you doing?
ReplyDeleteAre you really spurring on support for Hamas? So they can attack Israel again? so Israel will attack again and leave more dead both sides?
Or are you wanting peace? because if you want peace you shouldn't just argue against Israel, both sides need to sit back and take reflection on how murderous they have been.
I am against this occupation, I am also against what is happening in Gaza. A protest is never pointless, unless you make it pointless. By making outrageous demands, and effectively holding the University to ransom and using every possible development as an "action against us" you slowly close off any point to a negotiation, because you are basically laying down what you think before even attempting to debate anything with anyone outside the protest.
Security - Physics departments around the country have been broken into and had equipment and assets stolen... It has happened in Manchester twice... you want free movement into the building at night? can you guarantee the security of the building? NO you can't... so stop criticising management for trying to secure assets. If anyone has ever been broken into and there property stolen you would know that this standpoint is reasonable. If you don't think it is reasonable then maybe you should step back and think a bit more.
I have not been one bit insulting during this so please do add this down as valid criticism...
They ignore valid criticism - have done since the start
ReplyDeleteA cock on the roof, however, is hard to ignore
Be reasonable. A cock on the Arts tower roof, with a Palestinian flag inside. Now there's a statement we could all get behind!
ReplyDeleteIf you were to construct some kind of model cock, you could probably run the flag up it - a kind of neoclassical flagpole
ReplyDeleteOr maybe make it pop out of the top?
A flagpole AND a cock! That's just it, all the Freudian subtext you could ever want, connected to one particularly impotent cause!
ReplyDeleteAll his talk about roof based cock art as a legitimate form of protest is wrong. Surely everyone can see that sport stadium based penile art is vastly superior as a means for fighting persecution.
ReplyDeleteStadium based penile art is a tool of the Zionist oppressors
ReplyDeleteSolidarity to purveyors of roof based cocks
Joe three extremely valid critical posts:
ReplyDelete13:22
13:23
and my favourite one 13:25 !!!
what is your answer to these posts???
Cockart!
ReplyDeleteI like your manifesto, put it to the testo.
I don't know Marcin. What I would like to know is where Joe stands on the cock art controversy, stadium or roof? We must have an answer!
ReplyDelete"- Throughout the occupation, the management had accused the Occupiers of disrupting students’ education, and as a result, those involved have occupied a new space in which no lectures and seminars take place. This serves to demonstrate our continuing commitment to not disrupting students’ education."
ReplyDeletewhy are you still in the Hicks building then you silly little cunts
"Cockart!
ReplyDeleteI like your manifesto, put it to the testo."
Shouldnt that be testes?
"- Throughout the occupation, the management had accused the Occupiers of disrupting students’ education, and as a result, those involved have occupied a new space in which no lectures and seminars take place. This serves to demonstrate our continuing commitment to not disrupting students’ education."
ReplyDeletewhy are you still in the Hicks building then you silly little cunts"
Because there's a split in the organisation. Some wanted a building with a cafe (Jessops) and the others wanted to stay in the Hicks building because the seats are comfier, they're closer to Interval, and they've grown accustomed to the sleepover atmosphere.
Absolute disgrace, they should all be expelled from the University. Democracy… did they ballot every student before representing 'our' views? Think not… what a shame the porters don’t carry tazers.
ReplyDeleteOf course the conflict is not simplistic. Perhaps it is even fair to say that hamas would be as brutal to Israel as the Israeli government is to the Palestinian people, if they had the support of the USA and Britain instead of Israel.
ReplyDeleteHowever; they don't.
Quoting from todays guardian, "about 1400 Palestinians dead, including up to 300 children." compared to "21 Israeli deaths by hamas rockets"
It's really nice of you sit back and reflect on the situation, deciding that probably leaving them to it is the best option. Definitely that is the most humane thing to do in this situation. It's definitely an equal war. Definitely the lives of 1400 Palestinians are equal to less than 30 Israeli. Really i do not know what all the fuss is about. I bet those children completely understood what was going on and considered themselves fair game. Honestly those people far away from us in the middle-east are terribly messy, what a mess they've got themselves in, i do wish they'd stop squabbling and murdering each other and ruining my newspaper with their death tolls.
"It's definitely an equal war."
ReplyDeleteSo if it were, you'd be ok with that?
Again, the war isn't ongoing. It happened months ago. It's dead, leave it alone...
pathetic, people in palenstine couldnt care less about you pr!cks sitting in a building!
ReplyDelete"Because there's a split in the organisation. Some wanted a building with a cafe (Jessops) and the others wanted to stay in the Hicks building because the seats are comfier, they're closer to Interval, and they've grown accustomed to the sleepover atmosphere."
ReplyDeleteoh jesus, and to think I used to respect this cause. the seats are comfier???? you are making people move lectures because the seats in jessop make your bottoms sore? This is such a douchey protest.
SOLIDARITY WITH PALESTINE!... ooo... wait... no these seats are way to hard...
I can't believe you actually thought that was a valid statement, answer the questions posed in 13:25,13:22 and 11:46, these are valid questions, if not answered the occupation has no legitimacy.
What on earth do you mean "the war isn't ongoing" ?
ReplyDeleteYes it is.
If we get a big enough petition will you democratically draw cocks on your own faces?
ReplyDeletecomfy chairs in hicks? interval? sleep over atmosphere?
ReplyDeleteWell that is a completely made up load of rubbish. Please refrain from lying. and 14:09, you're an idiot for believing it.
"pathetic, people in palenstine couldnt care less about you pr!cks sitting in a building!"
ReplyDeletethats because they have no buildings left LOL.
i agree with the majority here though people, this occupation is a farce!
comfy chairs in hicks? interval? sleep over atmosphere?
ReplyDeleteWell that is a completely made up load of rubbish. Please refrain from lying. and 14:09, you're an idiot for believing it.
your an idiot
Just read the VC's email.
ReplyDelete'We also reserve the right to take disciplinary
action against anyone who is found to be breaching University regulations as
outlined in the Students' Charter.'
So much for demand 11! I can't wait to see you all get what's coming to you!
SOLIDARITY WITH THE UNIVERSITY!
"your an idiot"
ReplyDeleteit's "you're"
ffs
ditto
ReplyDelete"comfy chairs in hicks? interval? sleep over atmosphere?
ReplyDeleteWell that is a completely made up load of rubbish. Please refrain from lying. and 14:09, you're an idiot for believing it."
I apologise, you're right. It's a nightmare in that place. Tesco food parcels only able to be collected at the door. Demanding not to face punishment. A warm building. A roof at night. No violence. The ability to leave whenever you fancy. Why, it's just like Gaza...
I was being satirical, but it has a point-to claim that it's in any way bad is just bullshit.
"A roof at night"
ReplyDeletewith or without a cock on it?
Anyone opposed to the occupation, would you like to suggest some alternative approaches to supporting the people of Palestine? i think that would be constructive.
ReplyDeleteFAO 14.39 - Get out on the concourse and raise some money you lazy tarts.
ReplyDeletei think thats already been covered.
ReplyDeleteRefer to 'cock on roof' arguements above.
Whenever anyone makes a valid point on this blog it is entirely overlooked in favour of inane bickering. How embarrassing.
ReplyDeleteNo one cares enough to go down to the jessop west building and argue with the occupiers themselves. Or come up with a better idea. The occupation seems ridiculous because it is so small. If every student decided to speak out for the cause, a lot more notice would have to be taken.
Instead people sit down and write odd comments about the chairs in the hicks building. How does anyone dare try to undermine an attempt to help victims of war, without having a valid alternative ready.
people are uni are meant to be intelligent.
ReplyDeleteThis occupation = Not intelligent.
Discuss.
"could you like to suggest some alternative approaches to supporting the people of Palestine?" A typical display of ignorance from a lazy hippy. Have you not bothered yourself to read about the new craze for penile art based protest. Its all the rage.
ReplyDeletethrowing money at a problem won't help it.
ReplyDeleteWe help provide the arms that kill Palestinian civilians.
Then we collect small change in a bucket to send to these Palestinians.
is that what you're suggesting?
"How embarrassing.
ReplyDeleteNo one cares enough to go down to the jessop west building and argue with the occupiers themselves."
I had an argument with them last week on the concourse, during one of their inspiring half hour stints, changing the world.
They people I spoke to were fucking morons, who didn't have an understanding of why they were in the theatres, what they wanted to achiever, or the situation in the middle east.
They're morons, doing moronic stuff.
so its agreed:
ReplyDeleteA cock on the roof.
Money collection makes sense. There is loads of charity organization that could use this money and really help suffering people not only in Palestine...
ReplyDeleteIs that not sexist?
ReplyDeleteThe roof cock manifesto cannot be ignored. The people have spoken.
ReplyDeleteok a cock and lady garden.
ReplyDeleteSo you think that trying to get the Uni to withdraw investment from BAE (which I guarantee they won't do) will stop the flow of arms to Israel? That's pretty damned naive. And anyway, what are you doing to stop the production of Qassam rockets in Gaza?
ReplyDeleteSo in short, yes, I think efforts to raise money would prove far more helpful for Gazans than the token gestures you're trying to extort out of the University.
good point with the rockets - reply from the occupiers would be good on that...
ReplyDelete"throwing money at a problem won't help it.
ReplyDeleteWe help provide the arms that kill Palestinian civilians.
Then we collect small change in a bucket to send to these Palestinians.
is that what you're suggesting?"
In your world everybody loves everyone, we are all brothers and so on.
Unfortunately in real world people are not decent, people behave like animals, people kill each other and that's why each country needs an army and the arms to protect its own citizens...
This is the world we live in. How do you suggest 6 bln of beasts can be converted to peace loving humans?
It is nonsense, and do not write that if we all really want ... bla bla bla...
14:41 about money collection
ReplyDeleteOne of the demands is that the university publicise the Disaster Emergency Committee (DEC) and i've been behind a few of the gaza occupation stalls and theres a collection box, as well as selling free gaza badges, the money goes to as far as I'm aware the PSC (Palestine Solidarity Campaign)
but if you're wary of the occupation please give here - http://www.palestinecampaign.org/index2b.asp
waiting for replies from people correcting my spelling, grammar, or simply twisting my words.
natasha.
"How does anyone dare try to undermine an attempt to help victims of war. without having a valid alternative ready"
ReplyDeletethank you and goodnight.
"So much for demand 11! I can't wait to see you all get what's coming to you!"
ReplyDeleteI hope you never will have to see what war is like mate. Your over-sheltered ass would wish there's someone in some part of the world thinking about it.
As far as democracy is concerned:
If the majority wants all the occupants expelled from University, you should be supporting the occupation, cause you're fighting for the same cause! The University will never expel 150 of its own students, because they form a substantial part of the Vice-Chancellor's 280000 pounds per year salary. Same with BAE and Boeing and so on.. It's the same principle, the University cares more about the money it can make rather than the opinions of its students. This whole thing aims to make the University LISTEN to the students, because they have something to say!
Join the occupation, when it succeeds you can then demand that all occupants are expelled. At that point, the University will probably listen. Until then, you're equally ignored as everybody else. Satisfied?
If you can't understand this, then you can probably tell your daddy to buy the University for you and you can then personally expel anyone you like.
"Throughout the occupation, the management had accused the Occupiers of disrupting students’ education, and as a result, those involved have occupied a new space in which no lectures and seminars take place. This serves to demonstrate our continuing commitment to not disrupting students’ education"
ReplyDeleteSo where be the logic in occupying a space in Jessop which IS in fact used for teaching? The exhibition space is used regularly. Did anyone think to research this before diving in?
i refer to the ricky gervais joke "i turned away from politics at uni... i looked across at the marxists module queue and i though i couldnt bare to be stuck in a room for 3 years with what i called at the time 'cunts'"
ReplyDeleteha that sums this up perfectly.
ReplyDeletewhether its your or you're, you are still an idiot.
ReplyDeleteNo answer to the question of stopping Hamas rockets then?
ReplyDeletethey haven't answered due to the fact they can't.
ReplyDeleteWhat this blog needs is an an easy to digest synopsis of Gaza and the West Bank. That way we can all analyse the situation and address the issue like adults.
ReplyDeleteIts on we are coming to get you!!!!
ReplyDeleteHow do you like your CS gas?
PC Plod
“Again, the war isn't ongoing. It happened months ago. It's dead, leave it alone...”
ReplyDeleteJust because it is off the frontpages doesn’t mean life is any better in Gaza, the Palestinian people there and in the West Bank still live lives defined by checkpoints, poverty, oppression and discriminatiom. The occupation is a relevant now as it would have been in January
“pathetic, people in palenstine couldnt care less about you pr!cks sitting in a building!”
They do care, check the comments on this blog from Palestinians.
“And anyway, what are you doing to stop the production of Qassam rockets in Gaza?”
The rockets will stop when Israel ends its systematic persecution of the Palestinian people.
"i don't have anything against occupiers being in the talks with the uni but please don't pretend the demands are the occupiers alone because they were clearly drawn up by another group"
ReplyDeleteMany who were present in those meetings (Sheffield Students Against Israels Attack On Gaza) are heavily involved in the occupation movement too.
In addition to that, an attempt at negotiations with the management had been tried before, and obviously failed (the management failed to reply 5 days after the deadline the original group gave them, and did not reply since), this is why they went into occupation, and it is only because of the occupation that negotiations seemingly opened up again.
Another point to make is that there were further additions to their demands, namely, the solidarity with university workers, and with Israeli refuseniks, which were not in the original demands.
"Not willing to face the consequences of your actions - pathetic"
Likelihood is that they're already in a lot of shit, they've defied University management time and time again, been through a court case, in which they mentioned certain individuals and facebook admins, so before you go calling other people cowardly, get off your own fucking arse and do something yourself.
"No answer to the question of stopping Hamas rockets then?"
The occupation has not condoned any attacks against civilians whatsoever, we do not offer support to reactionary organisations like Hamas, although I personally see their actions as a result of occupation, blockade and murder of Palestinians, while giving them no political or military support.
Also, lets not forget the fact that Israel funded Hamas as an alternative to Fatah when the latter were much more dominant.
All in all, full solidarity to the Occupiers, and a big piss off to all you over privileged dicks who feel comfortable sitting behind your computer spewing absolute shit.
'The rockets will stop when Israel ends its systematic persecution of the Palestinian people.'
ReplyDeleteAre you joking? One of the founding tenets of Hamas is the total destruction of the Israeli state. While Hamas is still around, there will be no peace in Gaza. But I don't expect the occupation to listen to reason.
I somehow doubt that completely - how can you be assured that will happen?
ReplyDeleteI've been a part of the occupation and I 100% disagree with Hamas, stop tarring us with the same brush, I'm not a member of any farleft political party.
ReplyDeleteGo to the occupation and ask your questions, you'll find most of them don't support Hamas.
'All in all, full solidarity to the Occupiers, and a big piss off to all you over privileged dicks who feel comfortable sitting behind your computer spewing absolute shit.'
ReplyDeleteI find it all a bit too high and mighty for occupiers (or worse mere supporters of the occupation) to judge critics on here since essentially all you're doing is sitting on your behinds till the University gives you what you want.
I'd have total respect for you if you were trying to do something productive for Gaza (e.g. raising money or even better going there to help out), but you're not.
We're not saying you do - but maybe indirectly you are showing support for Hamas. Isreal shouldn't attack them - but Hamas shouldn't have been sending rockets in and killing soldiers. A country has the right to defend itself, though i agree Isreal went slightly to far.
ReplyDeleteNevertheless, what are you going to do about the production of Hamas rockets? The question remains.
i much prefer talking about cocks on roofs tbh
ReplyDeleteIf they did that I think the whole of the UK would be interested and support their cause.
ReplyDeleteif the occupation has no politcal motives other then peace in gaze, how come they are flying palenstinian flags? makes no sense to me!
ReplyDelete"Are you joking? One of the founding tenets of Hamas is the total destruction of the Israeli state. While Hamas is still around, there will be no peace in Gaza. But I don't expect the occupation to listen to reason."
ReplyDeleteI agree but Hamas thrives on offering a radical alternative to Israeli occupation, when such occupation goes, Palestinian people will see past the hollow promises and reactionary politics and abandon Hamas.
Cocks on roofs is so last year, breasts on buildings is what all the trendy young activists are doing. Well that and poncing around in buildings and ignoring their startling lack of democratic mandate.
ReplyDeleteTell you what .. if these work dodging tax sponging oxygen thieves want to show solidarity with the Palestinians why not just go over there. That way you can bring your protest onto television hopefully.
ReplyDeleteAnd if you could bring your own orange boiler suits with you I am sure that would be a big help.
Idiots.
At last a policy in keeping with these enlightened times. Solidarity!!!
ReplyDeleteMartin,
ReplyDeleteOccupations around the country have been successful in getting varying demands, including total divestment from the arms trade at Cardiff university. Occupations work, that is a fact.
Whether or not this one works is of course a matter of opinion but I am perfectly comfortable to try in the hope that we succeed and totally fail than never try to succeed for fear of failing: It's called conviction.
it's because they are liars - if they want aid, go organise some fundraising or something like that, you know actually make a difference rather than sitting in a room annoying people
ReplyDeletei heard a rumour that the occupiers have got a hippy style drum circle going and are all vegetarian and gay. is there any truth in this?
ReplyDeleteJoe, if you truely truely believe that the Uni's will do total divestment, you are truely naive beyond belief
ReplyDelete7) Allow those studying medicine to carry out their electives in the occupied territories of Palestine.
ReplyDeleteI am a fourth year medicine student and I can honestly say I would rather stay in this safe and pleasant country to practice, but thank you for wanting to send my to that war torn place!
Israel will be shitting themselves about a condemnation from Sheffield Uni.
ReplyDeleteNo work that any of you should be doing? You know, that stuff that those of us with jobs pay our taxes for you to do?
Joe,
ReplyDeleteI agree with the post from 16:20. Besides few days ago you said that uni is financed in 50% by arm trade.
I find it hard to believe. Are there only arm trade companies? I thought there are other branches of economy interested in funding universities. Uni = arm trade isn't it a bit paranoid????
As I said previously cutting the links to arm trade is not going to solve any problems of the world.
Come on, I said cocks ON buildings, not IN buildings
ReplyDeleteI have just taken time to read all the comments on the page and I have to admit that I am a little disappointed. I had hoped that the Occupiers, who are obviously so emotionally invested in this cause, would have taken the time to get a coherent point across but instead they resort to berating anyone who doesn't agree with them. I would hope that there are relatively intelligent people behind the occupation who could at least explain and try to convince the others of us of their point of view. It does them no favours to give responses which, for the most part, consist of calling people names and swearing.
ReplyDeleteIf you want constructive, valid comments to be posted here you have to respond in kind. Otherwise you do yourself no favours.
As I am sure most people here are, I am completely against the abhorrent loss of life in both Palestine and Israel and I do my part for the cause. However, I feel that the demands are unrealistic and that protest seems poorly organised and poorly directed.
Please convince me otherwise. Engage with us here on a sensible level. We have all seen your demands (I'm not sure why you have decided to add no. 10 in there unless it is an attempt a vote winner). Now take the time to talk to us. You have an audience of people who could be bothered to check out this blog so talk to us about the rationale behind your occupation over other forms of engagement with the University; why did you pick the demands you did; convince us of the reason to move to a protest over a coherent, well-argued proposal to the management (as what I have seen so far has not been well argued).
Take the time to stop these comments from being a mere slagging match to being something valuable for us all.
Sorry, I forgot to add that you lose credibility very quickly when you quote poorly researched facts that turn out to be wrong. Your point about the VCs wage is incorrect as is your point about 50% of the University's income coming from the arms trade. It only takes a little look to find that those are false, so please be more careful with them.
ReplyDeleteI agree James, but trying to get a response which doesn't consist either personal abuse or attempted guilt trips about 'not knowing what it's like in a warzone' seems beyond the occupiers (the latter is particularly perplexing as I doubt the majority of the occupation know what it's like either). Some of us have been trying to do this for days but have yet to receive answers to some of our most basic questions. Of course on the other side puerile one-liners don't help either, but the occupiers have to realise that they have forced the issue and thus it is their duty to explain their actions. And I don't see why they can't take the time to do this online as well as in person at the site of the occupation.
ReplyDeletecocks on roofs dammit.
ReplyDeletewill you please actually gain the support of the student body and put a nice big fat cock somewhere we can see it.
then i might have some time for what you are doing, at least then SOME good will come of it. s it stands, it hasnt managed anything to my knowledge past disruption, and not even much of that.
"Some of us have been trying to do this for days but have yet to receive answers to some of our most basic questions. Of course on the other side puerile one-liners don't help either,"
ReplyDeleteIf they refuse to give answers to sensible questions, it's little wonder the one liners appear.
It's still less childish than occupying random buildings
Can the occupiers please state their position on the 'cock on roof' idea. This would be gratfully recieved.
ReplyDeleteYours -
The REAL WORLD occupiers.
im glad theyv moved to jessop - dont have to put up with seeing their pointless pro palenstinian propaganda when i go to my lectures
ReplyDeletei occupied your mum last night.
ReplyDeleteAs a matter of fact I don't think that the university will divest with the arms trade but that wasn't really my point. My point was that occupations have succeeded things, that being one of the most impressive concessions.
ReplyDeleteYour demands make no sense at all. Even if by some miracle (calling in a bomb threat in the name of democracy or something) you get the uni to agree to what you want it will make no difference to the Israel/Gaza situation. The UK government are fanatical supporters of Israel, along with the USA, and bugging the university staff and students isn't going to change that.
ReplyDeleteYou seem to be the same attention seeking "anti-fascists" behind the Kick 'EM off Campus nonsense and now that's failed you've changed tactics and found another way to complain. Has it ever occured to you that perhaps some of the physics/maths/engineering students ALREADY KNOW what Rolls Royce and BA produce and actually want to work with them?
Can someone also explain why the Black Students society or whatever it's called is involved as a group?
They make no sense to you, I'm sure. But they in fact make a great deal of sense to us, to those who have engaged with the process and who supports us.
ReplyDeleteYou're views of what makes sense are actually irrelevant.
"You're views of what makes sense are actually irrelevant."
ReplyDeleteWhy are they exactly? God forbid you actually talk with other students and take their opinions into account. You haven't answered or responded to anything I've said. You can't just say something makes sense or that it is not relevant - you have to make some attempt to explain why.
seriously - the rockets question - answer please.
ReplyDeleteGive it up = they're not interested in engaging with other students. They're living in some idealistic world where their end justifies any means. I've finally realised we should just ignore them, wait for them to the forcibly evicted (as they will be), sent down from Uni or just fail their degrees as a matter or course.
ReplyDeletethey rockets will magically disappear as soon as the occupation wins its demands (the ultimate political smackdown to israel). haven't you been listening??
ReplyDeleteI heard something about a cock on a roof?
ReplyDeleteI apologise and now realise 'rocket disappearance' will appear as demand number 12.
ReplyDeleteRegards, Real world occupier.
yeah if they paint a cock on the roof we'll all go celebrate with them. They're discussing over tofu.
ReplyDeleteYou critics have to be the laziest people ever!! Seriously if you think your opinion of the occupation is so important go down and engage people in a discussion.
ReplyDeleteTo think that you'd be able to get a reasonable coherent response in the midsts of all this trolling and outright insults is just mad or just plain arrogant. We are happy to engage people in debate but you have to make the commitment to actually come and initiate that process. Otherwise frankly you don't deserve a response.
To think that you'd be able to get a reasonable coherent response in the midsts of all this trolling and outright insults is just mad or just plain arrogant. We are happy to engage people in debate but you have to make the commitment to actually come and initiate that process. Otherwise frankly you don't deserve a response.
ReplyDeletebollocks, i went down the other day and was refused entry for wearing an israel football shirt and having a st davids star drawn on my forehead.
i cant wait until you're kciked out of uni.
"Give it up = they're not interested in engaging with other students. They're living in some idealistic world where their end justifies any means. I've finally realised we should just ignore them, wait for them to the forcibly evicted (as they will be), sent down from Uni or just fail their degrees as a matter or course."
ReplyDeleteCongratulations you have managed to convert the act of spineless sycophancy into a total world philosophy. I hope the sado-masochistic gentleman's club you will inevitably join in later life treat you like the absolute tool you truly are.
"i cant wait until you're kciked out of uni."
ReplyDeleteWell I actually work here so sorry no luck there.
Well I actually work here so sorry no luck there.
ReplyDeletealright then, i cant wait until you get kicked. better?
Congratulations you have managed to convert the act of spineless sycophancy into a total world philosophy. I hope the sado-masochistic gentleman's club you will inevitably join in later life treat you like the absolute tool you truly are.
ReplyDeleteyeah... well at least he doesnt speak like a twat.
"alright then, i cant wait until you get kicked. better?"
ReplyDeleteWhatever makes you happy :D
mike, it really would!
ReplyDeletewhy bring over more terrorists to bomb our cities? the muslims pretty much unanimously hate us and our culture anyway
ReplyDeleteWhat opinion do you want me to take into account? So far all I have witnessed is conjecture, a refusal to actual engage with what is being said and then repetition.
ReplyDeletePerhaps you want me to take into consideration the fact you think I'm a moron, that it's futile, that it's morally reprehensible, that I should "respect your right" to not give a shit?
Actually no, I'm not going to care about that.
ok, so the original question that still hasnt been answered about the Hamas rockets? Anyone?
ReplyDeleteyou have just as much right to protest about palenstine as we do with your occupation of a university building!
ReplyDeletehowever, your method of occupying a building is much more childish then a few jokey internet insults!
"Childish"? How is that a coherent argument? How does that in any way refute anything that's been argued or the delegitimise our tactics?
ReplyDeletedelegitimise your tactics?
ReplyDeletethe fact they are illegal tactics shows how rediculous that statement is!
and as i said childish in method not argument! read it again sunshine.
IRL-pen0r on roof 4 graet lulz
ReplyDeleteIt's spelled "ridiculous".
ReplyDeleteIn any case the law is irrelevant. I am willing and advocate the necessity of civil disobedience. And yes that means breaking the law, shock horror.
the law is irrelevant, hmm ok
ReplyDeletei'll go rob your house, take all your posessions, few random assaults on you and your family
but I demand i face no repercussions from my actions.
because I believe in it.
100/25000 students is .004% Surely this is not a democratic majority? Demanding the university to succumb to your demands is ridiculous. If it is a democratically run university that you seek, why not ask them to put these demands to a student/staff vote?
ReplyDeleteAnd if you find profiteering Universities to vile why pay your fees here?
What if there is a significant portion of the University body who does not believe in your cause and the University does commit itself to your cause? How is that fair to their democratic rights?
Think about what you say, because "demands" like these are moronic and you are making fools of yourselves regardless of the subject in concern.
"i'll go rob your house, take all your posessions, few random assaults on you and your family
ReplyDeletebut I demand i face no repercussions from my actions."
Funny. That was the kind of things happened to Palestinians.Viva Palestina!!!
ROOF COCK, ROOF COCK, ROOF COCK, ROOF COCK, ROOF COCK, ROOF COCK, ROOF COCK, ROOF COCK, ROOF COCK, ROOF COCK, ROOF COCK, ROOF COCK, ROOF COCK, ROOF COCK, ROOF COCK, ROOF COCK, ROOF COCK, ROOF COCK, ROOF COCK, ROOF COCK, ROOF COCK, ROOF COCK, ROOF COCK, ROOF COCK, ROOF COCK.
ReplyDeletecock on a roof please
"What opinion do you want me to take into account? So far all I have witnessed is conjecture, a refusal to actual engage with what is being said and then repetition."
ReplyDeleteThe ones I posted that YOU refused to answer or engage with. People will only repeat what they said before when they did not get an answer the first time.
"Perhaps you want me to take into consideration the fact you think I'm a moron, that it's futile, that it's morally reprehensible, that I should "respect your right" to not give a shit?"
What do you assume people don't give a shit about? You know nothing about the people you abuse for not supporting you other than the fact that they don't agree with your actions. For all you know they partake in plenty of legal and effective activites for the Gaza cause yet nothing they have to say matters because YOU say so?
"Actually no, I'm not going to care about that"
Yet you wonder why there is so little respect for you and your actions.
Who have I abused?
ReplyDeleteI'm also still not sure what opinion it is you want me to care about? You're just typing words without actually saying anything.
And obviously civil disobedience is not comparable to breaking in to my house and assaulting my family and any comparison is wholly redundant.
I've gotta say ive gone from liking the group's presence and enthusiasm around the union, to finding the whole movement a farce. Essentially what your doing is blackmail and ive lost all respect for your movement. Its highly unlikely you'll ever get any of your oversized list of demands, and im pretty sure (and hopeful) someones going to get expelled for nothing. Surely a better use of your time would be to get a good degree, get a good career, and donate your money and or time in a useful manner. Hell, between you, you could probably pay for that scholarship things yourself. So yeah, please just end this occupation, your losing respect you might not ever get back.
ReplyDeletecya.
"What opinion do you want me to take into account? So far all I have witnessed is conjecture, a refusal to actual engage with what is being said and then repetition."
ReplyDeleteThere has actually been a lot of attempts to engage with what is being said, but a lot of questions and requests for clarification have so far been ignored by the occupiers.
Even if someone had painted a cock on the roof of every University building, you would have never noticed as you're sat here all day posting the same comment with slight changes.
ReplyDeleteThere is now a cock painted on the roof of ONE university building. If you find it, I'll take you seriously.
If you are so adamant to get peace between the Iraelis and Palestinians, which are you blackmailing a University? Why aren't you campaigning to the Government who can actually do something? Or better yet, if you want to engage with the University why not put together a well thought out, well-argued proposal for change rather than jumping straight to 'demands.'
ReplyDelete"you won't find many people who disagree with cause, what everyone opposes is the methods"
ReplyDeleteWhat if everyone who has written on here critisising the occupation agreed to meet up and discuss what could be done as an alternative? Maybe fund-raising ideas or having public speakers to further explain the Israeli-Palestinian conflict? What would be the best way to cease our involvement in the arms trade? How can we best make ourselves of use to those suffering in this war?
It seems to be fairly pointless trying to negotiate with the university and its vice chancellor, as they refused to negotiate before the occupation (despite consistent requests), or during it.
If people are so disgusted at an attempt to help the people of Palestine simply because they disagree with the method, use this reaction to fuel a more effective effort.
(although it is important to note that whatever opinion you have on the occupation, the vice chancellor is now willing to enter into negotiations with relevant groups concerning the issue of Gaza, something that he was unwilling to do prior to the campaign. Also that occupied universities across Britain have been meeting their proposals as a result. No one can argue that occupation point blank does not work.)
The occupation is fatally flawed in one respect.
ReplyDeleteBy occupying building that doesn't belong to them, against most public support, surely they have more similarities with the aggressive forces of Israel than the Palestinians? Just a thought...
The occupation is fatally flawed in one respect.
ReplyDeleteBy occupying building that doesn't belong to them, against most public support, surely they have more similarities with the aggressive forces of Israel than the Palestinians? Just a thought...
Anon 22:17 is right, who here would be willing to start a fundraising day?
ReplyDelete"Security - Physics departments around the country have been broken into and had equipment and assets stolen... It has happened in Manchester twice... you want free movement into the building at night? can you guarantee the security of the building? NO you can't... so stop criticising management for trying to secure assets."
ReplyDelete'Free movement' in terms of an occupation generally means the ability to do basic things like get food and water in and being able to go to the toilet. This was done with merely two security guards in the occupation at Manchester and guess how long the arrangement worked for - a month! By the way, I am a physics student at Manchester and the break ins happened even with controlled entry into the building. They solved the problem quite easily with CCTV and swipe card entry to labs!
Stay steadfast and work hard at getting your message across and out to other students. It took us a month at Manchester but we are currently in the middle of a timetable of negotiations with Alan Gilbert, who was quite hard-nosed and unreasonable at first. We have already won several demands and are looking at compromises for the others. One thing I would say is research research research so that you can show you understand why and how to implement what you're asking for. If you feel disheartened read the post further up from the students' movement in Palestine; it really does mean a lot to people who feel as if none of their voices are ever heard.
Good luck and I'll be down tomorrow to show solidarity!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wAZTLVJSlNw but has the roof?
ReplyDeleteIt's spelled "ridiculous".
ReplyDeleteIn any case the law is irrelevant. I am willing and advocate the necessity of civil disobedience. And yes that means breaking the law, shock horror.
Joe, you are such a norrow minded little curly haired beret wearing dick!
To have a go at my spelling, bloody what is this! msn in year 8???
and law is law! law being what the majority of people want - what the law abinding people of the uni want!
I do not want to be tarred over with your self righteous brush when im trying to get a job!
if you think illegal action will work then i hope you enjoy getting bummed!
joe more like twat!
The occupation is fatally flawed in one respect.
ReplyDeleteBy occupying building that doesn't belong to them, against most public support, surely they have more similarities with the aggressive forces of Israel than the Palestinians? Just a thought...
110% agree!
they are no longer apolitical! they are pro palenstine though! bless them!
Even if someone had painted a cock on the roof of every University building, you would have never noticed as you're sat here all day posting the same comment with slight changes.
ReplyDeleteThere is now a cock painted on the roof of ONE university building. If you find it, I'll take you seriously.
stop standing on the roof again and get inside! this weather is abit nippy you know!
i used to be supportive of the whole occupation but have to agree that its foolish now! you cant answer criticism without insult and truely think your protest is justified!
ReplyDelete- another alienated student!
"Joe, you are such a norrow minded little curly haired beret wearing dick!"
ReplyDeleteThat's the best thing I've ever been called. That and a treacherous bearded lefty.
"you cant answer criticism without insult"
Can you show where it is that anyone has been insulting? Perhaps you think that the "moron", "beret wearing dick" and "twat" comments were by occupiers. Actually they're by people who oppose it. Mostly because they're incapable of formulating a coherent argument (or spelling it for that matter).
I wish the occupiers would stop saying the uni wont negotiate. They were and are negotiating with people and this is independent of any occupation because the negotiations had started *before* the occupation.
ReplyDeleteThe problem is a bunch of extremists seem to have decided negotiations involve the uni instantly caving in to all the demands. Naturally the university wont undertake further negotiations with such people.
That's clearly just not the case. Of course there are negotiations, that's why we've been calling for participation within them...How could we make the case that we believe we should be in the negotiations if we don't believe there are any? That's just silly. All our blog posts, Facebook posts and the blanket letter we ask people to send to the VC all state that we should be in the negotiations and therefore by default acknowledge that there are negotiations...What a bizarre claim to make.
ReplyDeleteBut you need to be realistic and everyone agrees. The only reason Burnett is prepared to sit down is because of the occupation. Without the occupation there would be no negotiations.
Another night has passed and I don't see any cocks
ReplyDeleteWell, not on the roof
I expect it done by the end of the day
The people have spoken!
Play it and sing along!
ReplyDeleteI don't want to lose you
This good thing
That I got
'Cause if I do
I will surely,
surely lose a lot
'Cause your love is better
Than any love I know
It's like thunder and lightning
The way you love me is frightening
You better cock, cock on roof, baby
I'm not superstitious about ya
But I can't take no chance
You got me spinnin', baby
You know I'm in a trance
'Cause your love is better
Than any love I know
It's like thunder, lightning
The way you love me is frightenin'
You better cock, cock, cock on roof, baby
Think I better cock, cock, cock on roof
Think I better cock, cock, cock on roof
Think I better cock, cock, cock on roof
Think I better cock, cock, cock on roof
Think I better cock
It's no secret about it
'Cause with his lovin' touch
He sees to it
That I get enough
With his touch all over
You know it means so much
It's like thunder and lightnin'
The way you love me is frightenin'
You better cock, cock on roof, baby
Think I better cock, cock, cock on roof
Think I better cock, cock, cock on roof
Think I better cock, cock, cock on roof
Think I better cock, cock, cock on roof
What would you do if you got your demands, vacated Jessop West and a group of Israeli students moved in immediately to demand the repeal of everything you achieved through the same means as you?
ReplyDelete"incapable of formulating a coherent argument". This and other threads on this blog are full of coherent argument. Every time anyone mentions your democratic illegitimacy you ignore it. Your university held elections for the students union to act as your representative body. You failed to get elected to that body. That democratically elected body does not support your actions. Why did you not campaign and win...is it because you are not representative of the views of the student body.
ReplyDeleteWhy does being an Israeli student mean you are necessarily opposed to sending aid to Palestinians?
ReplyDelete"This and other threads on this blog are full of coherent argument. Every time anyone mentions your democratic illegitimacy you ignore it. Your university held elections for the students union to act as your representative body. You failed to get elected to that body. That democratically elected body does not support your actions. Why did you not campaign and win...is it because you are not representative of the views of the student body."
ReplyDeleteIt's been said before - Get off your lazy ass, come down to the occupation and make your case. Until that point you have no credibility and we will continue to ignore you :)
OK sorry, allow me to rephrase:
ReplyDeleteWhat would you do if you got your demands, vacated Jessop West and a group of students moved in immediately to demand the repeal of everything you achieved through the same means as you?
Anyway your protest isn't just about sending aid, is it?
It's been said before - Get off your lazy ass, go up on the roof and draw a cock. Until that point you have no credibility and we will continue to ignore you :)
ReplyDelete1) Issue a statement condemning the disproportionate actions of the Israeli state against the Palestinian people.
ReplyDelete- Exactly why is this a Sheffield University affair? Surely one for the government?
2) Create a special programme of five Palestinian scholarships and waive all fees for current students from the occupied territories.
- I'd prefer to see university places given based on academic strength, not wealth or nationality.
3) Enter into an academic partnership with the University of Gaza.
- For what reason? Who gains what out of this?
4) Donate old books, computers and other relevant equipment to the University of Gaza, and pay for the transport of these materials.
- How about giving these to the people who can't afford to go to university in sheffield? or yorkshire? Why should Sheffield University incur any costs based on a war being fought half way round the world?
5) Publicise the Disaster Emergency Committee (DEC) appeal on Sheffield University notice boards, website and via email.
- Fair enough
6) Initiate a programme in partnership with students of divestment and ending links with the arms trade.
- Not going to comment on this one as I do not have the information you apparently do.
7) Allow those studying medicine to carry out their electives in the occupied territories of Palestine.
- This is an option, although from a University standpoint, I'd be worried about the implications should any student come to harm whilst working in such an area.
8) Commemorate the United Nations Palestine Solidarity Day on November 29th.
- I'm sure you can hold your own event if you wished to do so, as you could for the national coming out day, national aids day, national....
9) Echo the Occupation's statement of support with Israeli students who have been imprisoned for refusing to serve in the IDF.
- It is not the Universities place to make political statements of this nature. The university should be a teaching and research institution, no more. Likewise, it should not ban Nestle products but give students the information yet allow them to make their own informed choices, after all they are supposed to be encouraging bright, free thinking individuals.
10)That they face no cuts in jobs, wages or conditions.
- In general? Whether you like it or not, in the current climate, the university IS a business. I would prefer a more traditional style university, where students gain places based on academic strength and are not charged for the privilege, but the governments 50% target effectively destroys that ambition. Leave business decisions to the businessmen who work in the higher offices of the university.
11) That participants in, or supporters of, the occupation face no repercussions.
- People in contravention of any rules/regulations/laws should be punished as appropriate. I'm sure you'd only ask the same of the Israelis.
Dear Mike,
ReplyDeleteIndulge me. I'm a student at Sheffield who disagrees with your actions on principle, not due to disruption caused to me. Indeed I'm currently on my year abroad several thousand miles away and thus sadly unable to come and talk to you in person. In any case, as I've said before, seeing as your protest consists sitting on your arses till the University gives in, you'll forgive if I view your demand that we come to you as somewhat unreasonable!
Here's a thought, if you're so bothered, why don't you sacrifice your opportunity - find someone in need, give them your place at University and pay for their education. 1 by 1 you can make a difference, without affecting every other student who may not share your views and without "passing the buck" to the university, who are not exactly a world power.
ReplyDelete" Why did you not campaign and win...is it because you are not representative of the views of the student body."
ReplyDeleteDid the occupiers actually even try to campaign and win? Have they even tried to engage with the democratic process. Which candidates did you field in the elections for the students union...name them...I'm not convinced you have even tried.
"But you need to be realistic and everyone agrees. The only reason Burnett is prepared to sit down is because of the occupation. Without the occupation there would be no negotiations."
ReplyDeleterubbish. The negotiations started prior to your occupation and furthermore as was pointed out the demands are in fact plagiarised from other groups involved in those negotiations.
It's actually pretty practical. the blog is a pretty minor activity for the occupation and is only updated by two or three people at most. If you are under the impression that the whole occupation is somehow following every development of this thread then I'm sorry but most of them will not be and if you expect answers here on that basis than you are going to be ignored for that simple reason.
ReplyDeleteLarge numbers of people also seem to be under the misapprehension that somehow we haven't consider their point of view about union democracy, setting precedents for other occupations, direct action tactics etc. This is incorrect, we have we we just hold different values towards them. Occupiers have done two interviews with the Forge Press now where these issues have been comprehensively covered. People who have bothered to come down to the occupation have also had their questions answered and been treated with respect (whatever their view of what we are doing). I, however, am not going to initiate a discussion on a Comment forum on the legitimacy of representative democracy, minority-majority rights, direct action ethics etc. with anonymous posters. It is simply not the medium for it.
I suggest if you really want answers you send an email and try to make it as constructive in it's approach as possible.
Oh and cocks on the roof and all that.
"rubbish. The negotiations started prior to your occupation and furthermore as was pointed out the demands are in fact plagiarised from other groups involved in those negotiations."
ReplyDeleteThat's no right. We were all apart of that process, including the occupiers, who were involved in drafting the frst set of demands that went to the VC prior to the occupation. I know because I was in that meeting.